Curse

Caranthir Huan · Sep 12, 2011, 06:28 PM // 18:28

Hello all... Another returner to the game after a few years away. My Ele/Mo was my first character created in Prophecies with the story completed, a large chunk of Factions done (but not finished, I hated Factions), and a small chunk of Nightfall done....

Anyway, I returned to the game, bought EotN and have just completed the main story, with some of the side-quests remaining.

Now I'm aware the Fire build isn't what it was years ago and there is now better armour out there than my Flameforged and Stormforged armour, but I'm now wanting to get as much as I can for my HoM. It's been too long to remember the stories of NF and Fac. so not too interested really in doing them, would happily farm away to be honest.

Would you suggest remaining as a Fire Ele, or is there a better type of Ele build out there now? The game has changed so much I may as well be a newbie, and with me only having 20k or so to spend I'm at a bit of a dead-end. Advice and suggestions from those of you better at playing would be very welcome.

cataphract · Sep 12, 2011, 06:42 PM // 18:42

If you have max armor, and judging by your post - you do, there is no "better" armor than the one you have already. They might be better looking but they are in no way better stat-wise.

As fire is not good in Hard Mode you might want too look into air and earth builds. And if you want to farm (and boost your EotN rep titles along the way) there are the Vaettir and Raptor farms available.

But, most importantly, find a friendly guild. Play with them and learn from them.

Caranthir Huan · Sep 12, 2011, 06:54 PM // 18:54

Can you fill me in on the Vaettir and Raptor farms...?

And Air and Earth builds do more damage than Fire these days?

Cheers for the pointers, the guild I was in hasn't had more than 5 members online in the last 12 months, so help is a bit thin on the ground!

Cool Name · Sep 12, 2011, 07:17 PM // 19:17

Air is better than fire in Hard Mode. This is because in Hard Mode enemies have much higher armor. This is bad for fire magic especially, but all air magic has armor penetration, making it much more effective: http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:E/any_Invoke_Lightning_Hero

That build is under Hero section but I'm not sure why, it's perfectly viable for a player. Add in some PvE only skills you've gotten from EotN (like ebon vanguard assassin support) and it's great.

Vaettir farming: http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:E/Me_Obsi...Vaettir_Farmer
There isn't much to be said that isn't on that page.

As for raptor farming I'm not sure, I've never done it myself so I'm not sure how good eles are.

What I will say though is decide how much you want to get for HoM. If you want 50/50 then I would say it's best if you start learning some speed clears to start getting money faster. If you don't need much and are willing to grind a bit then vaettirs/raptors might be the way to go. But personally I only farm vaettirs when there are festival drops.

LifeInfusion · Sep 12, 2011, 07:46 PM // 19:46

If I were you I'd make a Necromancer, Mesmer, or Ritualist (if sitting around watching spirits kill things is okay with you) or wait it out til they get updated (not that soon).

All DOT AOEs such as Firestorm or Searing Heat cause mobs to scatter. That's about half the elementalist skills already.

Elementalists are very shoddy in Hard mode for the most part due to armor reduction of all elemental damage. Meanwhile, Mesmers got buffed massively (there skills also became more mindless: see Keystone signet, overload, Panic+wastrel's worry/wastrel's demise, or Clumsiness/Ineptitude/signet of clumsiness) and Necromancers have been armor-ignoring damage kings/queens for a while (Mark of Pain with Assassin's Promise, Orders with physicals, plus they can make minions to capitalize on barbs/death nova/Mark of pain). The most common thing for heroes for a long time was Discord necromancers, before Mesmers with Keystone Signet / Panic, plus Signet of Spirits Ritualists went into the mix.

As an illustration of how bad Elementalist damage is, Defile enchantments does 60+20 per enchantment at 15 Curses and it isn't that great. Liquid Flame does ~112 before armor reduction and then it turns to 80 if the target is 80 armor (many casters in hard mode). This is because every additional 20 armor causes a ~30% reduction in damage. So 100 armor mobs take half. If the condition on clumsiness is met (easily in PvE), it's an easy 92 damage at 15 illusion; Wandering eye is [email protected] illusion, Wastrel's Worry does [email protected] dom, Signet of Clumsiness does [email protected] dom, Unnatural signet does [email protected] dom, Cry of Frustration nets you [email protected] domination and interrupts, Shatter Delusions will net you [email protected] dom. Even if you wanetd to do direct damage Destructive was Glaive Ritualists with Spirit's Rift, Ancestor's Rage, Splinter weapon, and Channeled Strike do more.

see http://www.guildwars.com/gameplay/de...l_balances.php
Also see the persuasion of everything but eles,
http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_FoW_Mesmer_Spike , http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_FoW_Manly_Spike , http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_UW_Terraway, http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_DoA_Frostway, http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_UW_UBway
http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_2_Mesmer_Hero_Midline, http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_2_...t_Hero_Midline, http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_3_Hero_Discordway, http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_3_Hero_Spiritway, http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_7_Hero_FoCway

If you do go Elementalist read up on Jeydra's thread. http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/a...t10419956.html

* The best option if you don't use PvE skills (http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Pve_skill) is Invoke Lightning with Chain Lightning + Air Attunement. The armor penetration will net you 80 to 100 damage most of the time.
* Mirror of Ice doesn't boost AoEs because the armor ignoring bonus damage is only to the target of your spell. In case you were planning to use it with deep freeze + rust + Ice Spikes.

Wenspire · Sep 12, 2011, 09:30 PM // 21:30

If you can control the enemy scatter, Fire isn't bad when used with Standard of Honor. An example would be to sac Meteor Shower prior to unloading DoTAoE. Sac'ing Meteor Shower eliminates the casting time weakness, and running Assassin's Promise as your elite would pretty much nulify the other drawback of recharge time.

Air is a great line but lacks larger-scale AoE effect. You do get higher spike numbers, though.

No matter what line you go with, a good idea would be to have one of your heroes running some source of cracked armor effect. Weaken Armor is probably one of the better choices for this because of it's AoE effect.

cataphract · Sep 13, 2011, 06:36 AM // 06:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caranthir Huan

Can you fill me in on the Vaettir and Raptor farms...?

And Air and Earth builds do more damage than Fire these days?

Cheers for the pointers, the guild I was in hasn't had more than 5 members online in the last 12 months, so help is a bit thin on the ground!

1) Change the guild. Check out the recruitment sub-forums here on GWG. Most of them welcome players going after titles and it's probable you'll have people to vanquish and do missions with.

2) Air build 1: Enervating Charge, Lightning Orb, Invoke Lightning [E], GoLE, Chain Lightning, Air Attunement, Pain Inverter (PvE)
Air Build 2: Assassin's Promise, Enervating Charge, Ebon Vanguard Assassin Support (PvE), Lightning Orb, Finish Him! (PvE), Pain Inverter (PvE), Air Attunement
Earth build: Unsteady Ground [E], Churrning Earth, Eruption, GoLE, Earth Attunement, Pain Inverter (PvE), Ward(s) of Choice

3) Be sure to equip your two mesmer and three necro heroes and give them good skill bars. Use the pvx wiki for builds.

4) If you're planning to get the vanquisher titles, I'd recommend focusing on EotN reputation titles first. They have several skills that are very useful in Hard Mode. Maxing them prior to vanquishing is not a neccessity but rank 8 is easily obtained and absolutely good enough.

Caranthir Huan · Sep 13, 2011, 09:00 AM // 09:00

Thanks to all those who have offered advice, it would seem I'm very much behind the times, I can't believe how much the game has developed!

I'll look at changing my build to an Air or Earth one in that case though with only 20k in the bank I may struggle a bit. My heroes (the few that I have!) are woefully weak and poorly set up and I've read some of the builds you've pointed me towards. Once I'm able to get the hero skills required hopefully I can set them up much better. Seeing just how badly set they were has made me amazed I actually managed to complete the main story of EotN!

As to Guilds I plan to moving to GW2 so hopefully can find one which is active and newbie-friendly to help out and which is planning on continuing into the new game. I think I have perhaps left it a little late to be starting builds and characters over from scratch to do a decent job on my HoM but I'll certainly take on board all the advice that's been given.

Plutoman · Sep 13, 2011, 05:21 PM // 17:21

You have plenty of time till GW2! No worries on the HoM.

I'd recommend an invoke build, it's simple, and likely the cheapest and easiest to get.

Invoke/Chain/L-Orb/Attune/Aura of Resto and then whatever others skills you want to support it or the team. Chances are high you'll have at least 3/5 skills, anyways. A rune of sup air is cheap, I always go with superior's, and you can kit out as you go along!

InStars · Sep 13, 2011, 05:46 PM // 17:46

Try Assasin's Promise elementalist, it's a great build after you learn how to use it!

http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:E/A_Assas...e_Elementalist

Caranthir Huan · Sep 13, 2011, 05:47 PM // 17:47

Ok daft question, can you change your secondary profession then? Currently I'm an E/Mo.

InStars · Sep 13, 2011, 05:51 PM // 17:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caranthir Huan

Ok daft question, can you change your secondary profession then? Currently I'm an E/Mo.

Yes, there is an outpost called Senji's Corner in factions, you will find Senji [Profession Changer] there, he will change your secondary profession.

Plutoman · Sep 14, 2011, 02:52 AM // 02:52

Or just the big temple pvp place. Can't think of the name offhand o.O There's a profession changer in there.

Mouse at Large · Sep 14, 2011, 06:59 AM // 06:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by InStars

Try Assasin's Promise elementalist, it's a great build after you learn how to use it!

http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:E/A_Assas...e_Elementalist

An assassin elite, 3xPvE skills and a glyph......it hardly seems like you are playing an ele at all

Swingline · Sep 14, 2011, 08:32 AM // 08:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mouse at Large

An assassin elite, 3xPvE skills and a glyph......it hardly seems like you are playing an ele at all

Yea that combo gets old fast.

Once your bored with AP try out the other elemental lines for fun. As people said Air and Earth are your best bet. Air for armor pen, an Invoke Lightning build is your best bet. Earth because of the bonus KDs and slow effects that can keep mobs in AoE, Most Earth DoTAoE's are 5 seconds which is a good thing, the 10 seconds AoEs suck because by 5 seconds they are already scattered. Unfortunately Fire's glory days ended with the release of HM and Water is mostly used in GvG and HA.

Aviator The Hunter · Sep 15, 2011, 07:48 PM // 19:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caranthir Huan

Can you fill me in on the Vaettir and Raptor farms...?

And Air and Earth builds do more damage than Fire these days?

Cheers for the pointers, the guild I was in hasn't had more than 5 members online in the last 12 months, so help is a bit thin on the ground!

Lol, I started with those kind of guilds.. "New guild lf officers" you enter with barely 5 members.. 3 are 1 month away.. GL

Caranthir Huan · Sep 17, 2011, 07:49 PM // 19:49

Thank you for all the help and advice so far, much appreciated.

I've been trying to get back into the game now and am just getting absolutely owned, especially in the Asura areas with the Raptors etc, not as enjoyable as I remember! Haha.

So the general opinion for Ele's is that the Air-build is the best? I've ditched my Mo secondary in favour of Assassin however don't seem to have most the skills for the recommended builds, not to mention i'll have to ditch my staff and change all the armour mods which unfortunately i'm struggling to do with my 3.3k :P

I may sit it out and await GW2, i'm getting frustrated that my awesome Fire Ele is no longer awesome, but is a bit kak!!!

Cheers again for the hints all

Plutoman · Sep 17, 2011, 08:40 PM // 20:40

Like I said - simple is just Invoke / Chain / L-Orb / Attune / AoR. Any other skills are extra, however I like elemental lord, a rez, and a PvE skill of choice. Simple and easy.

The equipment isn't a big deal - don't stress on the armor mods, do them as you go, and the staff can work, the requirement only affects damage, of which you deal via skills anyways. Once you pick one up or feel stable financially in GW, then go for an air staff, but otherwise.. don't worry about it.

Quaker · Sep 18, 2011, 03:25 PM // 15:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caranthir Huan

there is now better armour out there than my Flameforged and Stormforged armour,

It sounds as though you go way back to before Insignias when you had specific armour for each Element. You'll find that you can now remove the element specific features of the armor and/or replace them with whatever Insignias you want. Which means, for example, that you could wear your Flameforged armour even as an air, water, or earth Ele.

Quote:

Would you suggest remaining as a Fire Ele.

I would say no. If for no other reason than just to try something new. Through the years, I've done fire, then water, and now, air. They each had there good points. Fire for damage/burning, Water for slow downs/damage, Air for spiking/blinding.
Of course, with the proper headpieces (with appropriate Rune), builds, and weapons, I can switch to either of them at a moments notice. (I've never actually done an earth build.)

DiogoSilva · Sep 18, 2011, 11:30 PM // 23:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caranthir Huan

I may sit it out and await GW2, i'm getting frustrated that my awesome Fire Ele is no longer awesome, but is a bit kak!!!

The GW's staff team are currently working on tweaks for the Elementalist class, so it's quite possible that fire eles might become viable again in the (near?) future. Eles are currently the worst caster class, but with updates coming someday, I'd say you should stick with your character for now and wait to see what happens.